carpenter bees

Lanterns, fences, gazebo, demado, grills, doors and windows...
michael langford
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carpenter bees

Sun Apr 12, 2015 11:30 pm

I try to be philosophical about the work that I do, it doesn't have to be perfect, isn't going to last forever (can't see it from my house...). Even with a "live and let live" attitude, it's disappointing to watch something you've spent time and money on get butchered by insects and rodents.

Here in Arkansas where I live, outdoor woodwork gets destroyed by carpenter bees. I tend to let them stick around, because they are pollinators, but they end up doing a lot of damage. While they will generally leave the hardwoods alone, any of the common softwoods (pines, cedars, redwood, cypress) become riddled with bore holes after a few seasons.

I have tried borate applied with a garden sprayer on existing structures, doesn't have much effect. Reading recently that sodium silicate is now being used as treatment for outdoor wood, I will look into that. Likely the same as borate, effective with pressure-treatment, limited penetration with superficial application.

At one time, I could get iron oxide primer that had a high percentage of iron oxide pigment (now it is only available commercially) and mixed with linseed oil and turpentine it is an effective primer/finish. Similar to old barn paint, which was casein/blood, it darkens with age. That, or any other paint coating, tends to discourage the carpenter bees.

The copper and arsenic based stuff is simply out of the question, and I need an alternative, preferably one that is effective for squirrels as well. "You may be smarter, but he has more time..."
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Chris Hall
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Re: carpenter bees

Mon Apr 13, 2015 10:01 am

There were huge numbers of carpenter bees down in Charlotte NC where I was just on vacation.

I would strongly suggest against any chemical means. i did notice painted woodwork seemed to discourage them.

How about providing a home nearby for them that would require less effort for the bees, or some sacrificial wood that they might prefer?

Around our house, we've been using these solitary nests from Lee Valley (http://www.leevalley.com/US/garden/page ... at=2,47236):
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They work well.
michael langford
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Re: carpenter bees

Mon Apr 13, 2015 8:37 pm

Thanks Chris, I will look into that solution. Part of the problem is that I left the bees alone in a redwood wisteria arbor for several years, and now they are established.
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Paul Atzenweiler
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Re: carpenter bees

Tue Apr 14, 2015 10:41 am

Here in Missouri we are have Ash Borers and they are killing a lot of ash trees. Several cities in the Kansas City area are trying to take steps stop them but apparently it may be too late.
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Chris Hall
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Re: carpenter bees

Tue Apr 14, 2015 10:54 am

Down in NC a lot of trees have bands around their trunk coated with a sticky substance to stop insects from crawling up the bark. Not sure which insect(s) that is meant to deter however.
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Chris Pyle
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Re: carpenter bees

Tue Apr 14, 2015 1:00 pm

Paul Atzenweiler wrote:Here in Missouri we are have Ash Borers and they are killing a lot of ash trees. Several cities in the Kansas City area are trying to take steps stop them but apparently it may be too late.
Maybe it's time to purchase a chainsaw mill/chainsaw and contact any tree disposal companies. I've heard they most often drop the tree and take it to the dump for a cost, this could be a good way to get a lot of Ash lumber for future projects.

Does anyone know how tree waste is taken care of in various cities? Is it contracted out to 3rd parties or is it a specific division within the city?
michael langford
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Re: carpenter bees

Tue Apr 14, 2015 6:05 pm

I would look into what you are likely to be taking home in that ash. You could be hosting a live borer infestation. The borers that attack living trees are usually a natural response to a stressed or otherwise unhealthy plant. Borers were devouring red oaks here during a dry summer a few years ago. Last year, another borer was taking out huge swathes of Ponderosa pines in Colorado...all side effects of massive climate change and poor forestry practices. (re: The Oak Beams of New College Oxford)
Having worked a bit with freshly-milled hardwood timbers, I have had some experience with powder-post beetles. Two genera, Anobiid, and Lyctidae, both do basically the same thing, help turn trees into topsoil. As far as I've been able to determine, eggs are laid in the cambium and become encased in the growing tree. After the tree is dead, the larvae hatch in overlapping annual cycles, chewing their way to winged freedom and reproduction. This may not be visible for several years. In the oaks, walnut, cherry (the dark-hearted deciduous trees) the beetle larvae are concentrated in the sapwood (sugars and carbs, yum!) and are less likely to damage the heartwood (tannins). The light-colored deciduous trees (ash, maple, beech, box elder) are highly susceptible to borers through and through. (Thoreau's anecdote about the beetle, last page of Walden)
Other trees produce resins that apparently resist most of the mechanisms of decay (catalpa, locust, cypress...)
Kiln-drying is one way to insure against insect and fungal infestation. Borates can be effective, but require drying and re-saturation as far as I know. Most of the other possible treatments involve some sort of toxin that you wouldn't want in your house.
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Chris Pyle
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Re: carpenter bees

Tue Apr 14, 2015 6:40 pm

michael langford wrote:I would look into what you are likely to be taking home in that ash. You could be hosting a live borer infestation. The borers that attack living trees are usually a natural response to a stressed or otherwise unhealthy plant. Borers were devouring red oaks here during a dry summer a few years ago. Last year, another borer was taking out huge swathes of Ponderosa pines in Colorado...all side effects of massive climate change and poor forestry practices. (re: The Oak Beams of New College Oxford)
Having worked a bit with freshly-milled hardwood timbers, I have had some experience with powder-post beetles. Two genera, Anobiid, and Lyctidae, both do basically the same thing, help turn trees into topsoil. As far as I've been able to determine, eggs are laid in the cambium and become encased in the growing tree. After the tree is dead, the larvae hatch in overlapping annual cycles, chewing their way to winged freedom and reproduction. This may not be visible for several years. In the oaks, walnut, cherry (the dark-hearted deciduous trees) the beetle larvae are concentrated in the sapwood (sugars and carbs, yum!) and are less likely to damage the heartwood (tannins). The light-colored deciduous trees (ash, maple, beech, box elder) are highly susceptible to borers through and through. (Thoreau's anecdote about the beetle, last page of Walden)
Other trees produce resins that apparently resist most of the mechanisms of decay (catalpa, locust, cypress...)
Kiln-drying is one way to insure against insect and fungal infestation. Borates can be effective, but require drying and re-saturation as far as I know. Most of the other possible treatments involve some sort of toxin that you wouldn't want in your house.
Thanks Mike, I'll make sure to avoid any trees that were ravaged by insect population (at least until I have a better understanding). I don't plan on buying a kiln anytime soon and I don't know that i want to deal with multiple applications for treatment.
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Chris Pyle
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Re: carpenter bees

Fri Apr 17, 2015 11:06 am

Hey Mike, here's an article showing a guy making use of these infested trees.

http://kcur.org/post/ash-trees-die-kans ... r-industry

Do you think this is poor practice? Or perhaps they are using high heat kilns to kill any embedded eggs/larvae.
michael langford
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Re: carpenter bees

Sat Apr 18, 2015 1:33 pm

The borer that is killing the Ash trees will probably complete its life cycle and move on. Powder post beetles may still be in the wood, and not emerge for many years (that's why they're called 'death watch'). It's possible, unless the wood is kiln-dried or chemically treated: not a deal-killer, just a risk to be aware of. Basically, trees are vulnerable to insects by being stressed in an urban environment, more likely to have a suppressed immune response to whatever's killing them.

Most of the hardwood dealers here went bankrupt after 2008. Brokers come through and contract with the local mills for container-loads of lumber to Vietnam, Philippines, China...manufactured into furniture...back stateside. Parasites exist at many levels.

I hope the guy in KC does well. Running a small sawmill is a lot of work, especially in urban timber. If this is moving toward a discussion about urban forestry and timber recovery, I would love to see examples of successful ventures. Thinking of a couple of enterprises that I know of, I'll look them up.

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